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Post by hhsussex on Mar 19, 2015 12:07:03 GMT
It does now look as if camps are being formed around the Chairman-elect and his CEO, on the one hand, and the loose axis of Downton and the selectors on the other. If so, there can be only one winner. The Chairman and CEO have the power to sack everyone in the other camp, who - as Stalin said of The Pope - don't have any tanks... But, as I said, we should all be the losers if the Chairman decides everything : that's the worst kind of micro-management. |
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Post by flashblade on Mar 19, 2015 12:11:55 GMT
If so, there can be only one winner. The Chairman and CEO have the power to sack everyone in the other camp, who - as Stalin said of The Pope - don't have any tanks... But, as I said, we should all be the losers if the Chairman decides everything : that's the worst kind of micro-management. I agree - dictators are dangerous . . . |
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Post by Wicked Cricket on Mar 19, 2015 15:46:55 GMT
I believe we need to look at Colin Graves as an individual. The son of a South Yorkshire farmer, he joined 'Spar' as a shelf-stacker
in 1968 and by the age of 37 had worked his way up through the ranks to become the company's chief sales director. In 1986, he
left the company and formed his own supermarket chain 'Costcutter'.
Initially, potential suppliers would meet Graves in his own kitchen. He grew 'Costcutter' into a household name with 1,600 stores
and an annual £640m sales. Graves is regarded as "a legend" in the convenience industry.
Later, he sold 49% of his shares to 'Bibby Line Group' in 2007 and the rest in 2011. It is alleged Graves made a personal fortune of
well over £55m from these two transactions alone.
That is pretty impressive. Only Giles Clarke can compete on the same entrepreneurial mantle.
As for Graves' passion for cricket, this poured out after Yorkshire were relegated to Division 2 in 2011. One remembers at the time his
tirade at the players, which seemed OTT and harsh, but it certainly did the trick. Three years later the team had won the Division 1
Championship.
You don't mess with Graves and I am a little surprised he is waiting to see how England do in the Windies. Perhaps, he doesn't want
people to think his actions are a knee-jerk response to the WC humiliation. Whitaker et al must know that unless England beat the Windies
handsomely, they are all for the chop, which must put an extra wind in their sails.
But where does this leave Pietersen?
Surely, Graves knows that the only way KP can return to the England camp is for a series of management sackings to follow. And if Graves gives
KP the nod to join Surrey and he amasses a load of runs, what a wonderful way of revenge. Score some 100s and in return you will secure the sacking
of those who sacked you. One doubts whether any player in the history of cricket has held their cricketing establishment to such a ransom.
English cricket is entering a fascinating and extraordinary period.
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Post by flashblade on Mar 19, 2015 15:53:46 GMT
I believe we need to look at Colin Graves as an individual. The son of a South Yorkshire farmer, he joined 'Spar' as a shelf-stacker in 1968 and by the age of 37 had worked his way up through the ranks to become the company's chief sales director. In 1986, he left the company and formed his own supermarket chain 'Costcutter'. Initially, potential suppliers would meet Graves in his own kitchen. He grew 'Costcutter' into a household name with 1,600 stores and an annual £640m sales. Graves is regarded as "a legend" in the convenience industry. Later, he sold 49% of his shares to 'Bibby Line Group' in 2007 and the rest in 2011. It is alleged Graves made a personal fortune of well over £55m from these two transactions alone. That is pretty impressive. Only Giles Clarke can compete on the same entrepreneurial mantle. As for Graves' passion for cricket, this poured out after Yorkshire were relegated to Division 2 in 2011. One remembers at the time his tirade at the players, which seemed OTT and harsh, but certainly did the trick. Three years later the team had won the Division 1 Championship. You don't mess with Graves and I am a little surprised he is waiting to see how England do in the Windies. Perhaps, he doesn't want people to think his actions are a knee-jerk response to the WC humiliation. Whitaker et al must know that unless England beat the Windies handsomely, they are all for the chop, which must put an extra wind in their sails. But where does this leave Pietersen? Surely, Graves knows that the only way KP can return to the England camp is for a series of management sackings to follow. And if Graves gives KP the nod to join Surrey and he amasses a load of runs, what a wonderful way of revenge. Score some 100s and in return you will secure the sacking of those who sacked you. One doubts whether any player in the history of cricket has held their cricketing establishment to such a ransom. English cricket is entering a fascinating and extraordinary period. Having looked at him, fluffy, do you think he intends to be a dictator? |
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Post by flashblade on Mar 19, 2015 15:57:06 GMT
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Post by Wicked Cricket on Mar 19, 2015 15:59:57 GMT
fb,
Having looked at him, fluffy, do you think he intends to be a dictator?
No, I don't believe so. Very occasionally, tough decisions must be made and often those decisions can only come from one
person. The critics might view this as dictatorial, but Clarke, imho, is far more of a Stalin than Graves ever will be.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 25, 2015 20:47:59 GMT
It seems to me that Cook is sailing very close to the wind.
He has now reportedly ''demanded clarification" from Colin Graves on what he has said to Pietersen about a possible return to the England team. Graves has allegedly given him a very dusty answer, to the effect that he should mind his own business and concentrate on scoring some runs in the West Indies.
It seems there's more intrigue and behind-the-scenes plotting in English cricket at the moment than anything the political parties are involved in as they scheme and manouevre ahead of another hung parliament in May.
Unless Cook scores some runs and learns to button his lip, I can see Joe Root being installled as captain by the time the Ashes series comes around.
It's odd, because my criticism of Cook was always that he was too much of a 'yes sir, no sir, whatever you say Mr Flower/Downton/Moores' company man. Yet over his enforced winter lay-off, his wounded amour propre seems to have caused a remarkable transformation into truculent and mouthy troublemaker.
Not sure which I prefer. Frankly, I'm not too keen on either!
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Post by invicta1977 on Mar 25, 2015 22:24:58 GMT
If so, there can be only one winner. The Chairman and CEO have the power to sack everyone in the other camp, who - as Stalin said of The Pope - don't have any tanks... But, as I said, we should all be the losers if the Chairman decides everything : that's the worst kind of micro-management. Yes, and I'm rather worried about the report in today's Standard: "After his initial conversations with incoming chairman Colin Graves and other ECB representatives, Pietersen is thought to have been certain he would have a fair opportunity of an England return if he scored heavily in Division Two of the Championship. Surrey’s first four-day game is at Glamorgan, starting on April 19".If the incoming ECB leadership has determined that Pietersen is now eligible for selection, that's a welcome move. But, surely it's down to the nominated panel of selectors to decide what players must do, where and when in order to satisfy their selection criteria? If the panel proves incompetent after a certain period of time, fine, change it. But, when in place, it should enjoy autonomy. If members of the highest leadership of the ruling body are able to directly influence individual selection decisions, have we really moved on from 1968 and another South African born England player? |
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Post by flashblade on Mar 26, 2015 8:20:49 GMT
S&F has assured us that Graves isn't a dictator . . .
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Post by Wicked Cricket on Mar 26, 2015 9:46:03 GMT
fb, There is 'Anarchy in the Cricket U.K' and Kevin Pietersen is the Antichrist. It will require some tough decisions ahead by Colin Graves as the Sword of Damocles hangs over the England management and some players while they gingerly venture to the West Indies. Given the inner turmoil and the side's poor form do not be surprised if another embarrassment awaits. Graves has already given his standard speech to England as he has various times to Yorkshire over the years. "Don't lose against West Indies or else!" This can't help the camp moral. Tough decisions require a brief but more dictatorial role and given how tarnished the England hierarchy are, the new man Graves is the only one who can make such changes. www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbmWs6Jf5dc&list=RDqbmWs6Jf5dc#t=0 |
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Post by invicta1977 on Mar 26, 2015 9:52:23 GMT
There is 'Anarchy in the Cricket U.K' and Kevin Pietersen is the Antichrist. He knows what he wants and he thinks he knows how to get it. |
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Post by flashblade on Mar 26, 2015 10:05:11 GMT
Does anyone else see the similarity between the KP and Jeremy Clarkson scenarios?
Some people will bend over backwards (and turn themselves inside out, if necessary!) to excuse behaviour that is totally unacceptable, because they think the prospect of future commercial gain and "success" makes it worth tolerating this behaviour.
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Post by hhsussex on Mar 26, 2015 12:08:48 GMT
fb, There is 'Anarchy in the Cricket U.K' and Kevin Pietersen is the Antichrist. It will require some tough decisions ahead by Colin Graves as the Sword of Damocles hangs over the England management and some players while they gingerly venture to the West Indies. Given the inner turmoil and the side's poor form do not be surprised if another embarrassment awaits. Graves has already given his standard speech to England as he has various times to Yorkshire over the years. "Don't lose against West Indies or else!" This can't help the camp moral. Tough decisions require a brief but more dictatorial role and given how tarnished the England hierarchy are, the new man Graves
is the only one who can make such changes.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbmWs6Jf5dc&list=RDqbmWs6Jf5dc#t=0Is this the Mussolini thread? A chairman who usurps the authority of his management team to impose his own will at any time - and particularly when he hasn't been properly inducted - is guilty of meddling and of disrupting the structure of the organisation. It matters not whether you approve of the cause he cites, the action is wrong and will always be wrong. The job of the selectors is to select according to the criteria set down for them when they were appointed, or as modified and agreed by the whole of the management team. Otherwise anyone - Graves, soft and fluffy or the Dalai Lama - can butt in at any time and claim that might is right and things are going to be done my way. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 26, 2015 12:24:37 GMT
Downton and Whittaker announced what was in effect a lifetime ban. I'm not privy to the details of the conversations that have taken place, but as far as I can see "the action (which) is wrong and will always be wrong" is simply that Graves has made it clear there can be no lifetime bans, for KP or for anyone else, if they meet the other criteria necessary for selection.
And that has to be correct - legally, morally and in every other way. To be honest, I think we're getting a little ahead of ourselves with all these accusations of dictatorship.
The 'dictatorship' that worries me far more is the The Observer's claim - still not verified, as far as I can see - that just four counties can veto structural changes to the English domestic game.
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Post by coverpoint on Mar 26, 2015 12:32:14 GMT
For Pietersen to be recalled he would have to score a bucket of runs and Cook, Moores, Downton and Whitaker would all have to be sacked first.
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