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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2016 10:25:50 GMT
Confirmed by Mark Davis in his interview with Adrian Harms.
Was told he wasn't being offered a contract for next season, so decided to leave with immediate effect and is now looking for another club.
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Post by coverpoint on Sept 1, 2016 14:14:43 GMT
Fair dos. Given a chance in the firsts off the back of 258* for the seconds but not up to the required standard I'm afraid.
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Post by hhsussex on Sept 1, 2016 16:29:44 GMT
Fair dos. Given a chance in the firsts off the back of 258* for the seconds but not up to the required standard I'm afraid. Which tends to beg the question "Is Second XI cricket fit for purpose as a selection process for first-class players"? |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2016 16:47:56 GMT
Fair dos. Given a chance in the firsts off the back of 258* for the seconds but not up to the required standard I'm afraid. Which tends to beg the question "Is Second XI cricket fit for purpose as a selection process for first-class players"? One also wonders why Davis and now Haines have been selected in recent matches ahead of Salt. Has Sussex already decided to give Salt a contract for 2017, so didn't have a decsion to make - and Davis and now Haines were picked for what were in effect auditions (which one of them has already failed and been shown the door)? This is what Mark Davis said in November last year about Salt, Hudson-Prentice, Garton and Whittingham when the four of them were handed what Sussex described as 'junior professional contracts for the 2016 season' :
“It’s exciting times for these four youngsters. This opportunity gives them a real chance to make a mark next summer and earn full contracts to really start to forge long and successful careers.”
Has Salt, or indeed any any of the quartet, made sufficient "mark" to have been awarded a "full contract"? You'd imagine that Whittingham and Garton have done so... |
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Post by hhsussex on Sept 1, 2016 17:00:53 GMT
Which tends to beg the question "Is Second XI cricket fit for purpose as a selection process for first-class players"? One also wonders why Davis and now Haines have been selected in recent matches ahead of Salt. Has Sussex already decided to give Salt a contract for 2017, so didn't have a decsion to make - and Davis and now Haines were picked for what were in effect auditions (which one of them has already failed and been shown the door)? This is what Mark Davis said in November last year about Salt, Hudson-Prentice, Garton and Whittingham when the four of them were handed what Sussex described as 'junior professional contracts for the 2016 season' :
“It’s exciting times for these four youngsters. This opportunity gives them a real chance to make a mark next summer and earn full contracts to really start to forge long and successful careers.”
Has Salt, or indeed any any of the quartet, now been awarded a "full contract"? Yes, Garton and Whittingham have both now been given contracts to the end of 2018. No word on Salt or H-P, but according to yesterday's briefing Salt is amongst those earmarked for extensive coaching in South Africa this winter, so presumably will be given at least a limited contract. |
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Post by coverpoint on Sept 1, 2016 17:11:57 GMT
Fair dos. Given a chance in the firsts off the back of 258* for the seconds but not up to the required standard I'm afraid. Which tends to beg the question "Is Second XI cricket fit for purpose as a selection process for first-class players"? The problem is at the moment there is too wider a gap between the firsts and the seconds. How do you make the seconds so it makes the players better prepared for first team cricket? Playing second team cricket in front of one man and his with no atmosphere is hardly a fitting learning ground. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2016 17:15:14 GMT
Sounds like H-P could be another one auditioning for his future in this match?
No pressure there, then...
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Post by coverpoint on Sept 1, 2016 17:29:04 GMT
Sounds like H-P could be another one auditioning for his future in this match? No pressure there, then... At Sussex we seem to throw them in the deep end and then toss them aside whereas at other more successful counties they invest in youngsters and give them time to develop. Perhaps the Sussex coaching staff would enjoy greater success if they allowed these players to develop properly. |
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Post by hhsussex on Sept 1, 2016 17:43:32 GMT
Sounds like H-P could be another one auditioning for his future in this match? No pressure there, then... At Sussex we seem to throw them in the deep end and then toss them aside whereas at other more successful counties they invest in youngsters and give them time to develop. Perhaps the Sussex coaching staff would enjoy greater success if they allowed these players to develop properly. In fairness I think that there has been a much greater awareness of the potential of youth this season and a greater willingness to blood players than for many years past. Of course this has largely come about because the purse is empty and we can no longer afford to fling money at old crocks in the hope they come good invest in more experienced players whose career has stalled at their former counties. Archer, Garton, Whittingham and Salt, the latter mostly in one-day cricket have all had pretty careful management this year, and maybe the same is true of Robinson, who is not very much older than Whittingham. The case of Davis is a bit different: he came to Sussex as a triallist after scoring runs for his University side and then his Second XI exploits, and he is 23, an age when you would expect something close to the finished article rather than a work in progress. What we saw against Gloucester and then against Glamorgan was a guy who looked to be out of his depth in the field as well as at the crease. |
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Post by coverpoint on Sept 1, 2016 17:50:36 GMT
At Sussex we seem to throw them in the deep end and then toss them aside whereas at other more successful counties they invest in youngsters and give them time to develop. Perhaps the Sussex coaching staff would enjoy greater success if they allowed these players to develop properly. In fairness I think that there has been a much greater awareness of the potential of youth this season and a greater willingness to blood players than for many years past. Of course this has largely come about because the purse is empty and we can no longer afford to fling money at old crocks in the hope they come good invest in more experienced players whose career has stalled at their former counties. Archer, Garton, Whittingham and Salt, the latter mostly in one-day cricket have all had pretty careful management this year, and maybe the same is true of Robinson, who is not very much older than Whittingham. The case of Davis is a bit different: he came to Sussex as a triallist after scoring runs for his University side and then his Second XI exploits, and he is 23, an age when you would expect something close to the finished article rather than a work in progress. What we saw against Gloucester and then against Glamorgan was a guy who looked to be out of his depth in the field as well as at the crease. I would agree with what you say to a large degree. I suppose in Davis is a different situation having previous played county cricket for Northants and aged 23. However, I do question how we are going to replace Joyce if he retires. I think we will struggle to attract a domestic opener as Warwickshire, a first division county, haven't managed to replace Chopra and another first division county Durham have yet to replace Stoneman. I feel we may need to sign an overseas opener next season. I would applaud the club for the way they have managed Archer, Garton, Whittingham and Salt. In relation to Hudson-Prentice and Salt I don't think it is realistic to expect a batsman to be the finished article at 20. I would expect them to make significant strides forward by the age of 23. |
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Post by jonboy on Sept 1, 2016 22:45:08 GMT
It's abundantly clear that we cannot replace Joyce from within, and we will probably have to go the overseas route to get similar quality. Likewise, there is nobody who could replace Taylor, if we're going like for like. Personally, I think an all rounder might be more useful, and we'll have to hope that one of Machan or Finch comes good. Failing that, Mr Davis needs to get himself over to South African and bring back one or two of those Kolpaks, he says, that are freely available.
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Post by Wicked Cricket on Sept 2, 2016 7:58:05 GMT
Given how much Sussex are relying on their Academy and 2nd XI players for the club's future, I do worry whether there will be sufficient
players of the required standard to emerge during the next 5 years.
Examples from the recent past have offered us Thornley, Gatting, Adkin, Brown, Beer, Machan, Hatchett and Wells, none of whom were/are stand-outs,
where even the most generous would say they are only average Championship cricketers.
Now there is Salt, Finch, Garton, Whittingham, HP and Archer. One might say a more promising crop but still will any of these compare to the past
cricketers like Prior, Yardy, Kirtley, Lewry, RMJ and Nash, 3 of whom went on to play for England.
It is easy for the club to ask supporters "for patience" over the maturing of our latest crop of youngsters but how many will actually make the grade
and take Sussex back to Division 1? And how much faith should we place in the lower team coaches? Why are the recent players not in the same
high league as their past luminaries?
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Post by coverpoint on Sept 2, 2016 8:22:00 GMT
Given how much Sussex are relying on their Academy and 2nd XI players for the club's future, I do worry whether there will be sufficient players of the required standard to emerge during the next 5 years. Examples from the recent past have offered us Thornley, Gatting, Adkin, Brown, Beer, Machan, Hatchett and Wells, none of whom were/are stand-outs, where even the most generous would say they are only average Championship cricketers. Now there is Salt, Finch, Garton, Whittingham, HP and Archer. One might say a more promising crop but still will any of these compare to the past cricketers like Prior, Yardy, Kirtley, Lewry, RMJ and Nash, 3 of whom went on to play for England. It is easy for the club to ask supporters "for patience" over the maturing of our latest crop of youngsters but how many will actually make the grade and take Sussex back to Division 1? And how much faith should we place in the lower team coaches? Why are the recent players not in the same high league as their past luminaries? Are the players the problem or is it the coaching staff aren't good enough to identify talent or bring the players through? |
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Post by Wicked Cricket on Sept 2, 2016 8:27:40 GMT
Cv,
A bit harsh with Brown, Machan and Wells.
Can you compare Brown with Prior or Machan with Yardy? As for Wells he appears more at home in Division 2 than Division 1.
We need to create a squad to return the club to Division 1. Where are these players going to come from?
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Post by coverpoint on Sept 2, 2016 8:37:59 GMT
Cv, A bit harsh with Brown, Machan and Wells. Can you compare Brown with Prior or Machan with Yardy? As for Wells he appears more at home in Division 2 than Division 1. We need to create a squad to return the club to Division 1. Where are these players going to come from? Prior and Yardy weren't great to begin with. I remember calls to release Yardy and Prior's one day batting average was extremely poor at the beginning. Machan scored three hundreds and Brown four last season in Division 1. As for Wells he has 13 hundreds most of which were made in Division One. We will need to replace Joyce and Magoffin with external recruitment but otherwise we should be looking as far as possible to develop our own players. We don't have the Spen Carma anymore and so won't be able to buy success by flashing the cheque as other counties can. Therefore making a success of the Academy is crucial to our future success. |
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