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Post by Wicked Cricket on Mar 18, 2020 9:53:09 GMT
Fb,
If you surf to the front page of WHO, it states (re: the coronavirus): "Most people who become infected experience mild illness and recover..."
Therefore, it appears that WHO and world governments have made an odd decision. Place the world's economy in dire straits to save a small minority of the world population ie. the over 70 year-olds or in the case of Italy the over 80 year-olds or those who already have underlying health complications. Either this shows the massive 'grey power' that the elderly hold over the world or something very askew is going on.
Today, the world population is nudging up to 7.8 billion. The number of people aged over 65 years-old represents around 16% of this total. Every year a primary killer of the elderly is seasonal influenza. There are a variety of different strains of which covid-19 is one of them. The contagion has now receded in China, helped by their warmer Spring weather, and things there are getting back to normal.
This present world panic is being caused by a media feeding frenzy exacerbated by the power of social media.
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Post by flashblade on Mar 18, 2020 10:56:37 GMT
WC - you seem to have become one of those journos suffering from confirmation bias; you have swooped on one sentence from the WHO site which you think supports your case. Try looking at the WHO site in more depth: Extract from WHO statement 16.3.20: "This is a serious disease. Although the evidence we have suggests that those over 60 are at highest risk, young people, including children, have died.
WHO has issued new clinical guidance, with specific details on how to care for children, older people and pregnant women.
So far, we have seen epidemics in countries with advanced health systems. But even they have struggled to cope.
As the virus moves to low-income countries, we're deeply concerned about the impact it could have among populations with high HIV prevalence, or among malnourished children."
That’s why we’re calling on every country and every individual to do everything they can to stop transmission."Also, this may stop you equating Covid-19 with existing flu viruses: www.who.int/news-room/q-a-detail/q-a-similarities-and-differences-covid-19-and-influenzaYou'll note that the best estimates of mortality rates show that Covid-19 could be up to 30-40 times higher than seasonal influenza. Don't forget: 1. This is a global pandemic, and county cricket is not a priority - for most of us, anyway. Every country has to co-operate. 2. It's wrong to assume that only the over 70s with underlying health conditions are at risk. Let's hope that we can soon study the data in China, once the experts are convinced that the virus has 'passed through'
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Post by Wicked Cricket on Mar 18, 2020 14:34:14 GMT
Fb, young people, including children, have died.
Children? Please find me the evidence. It is hard enough to find any that have caught the coronavirus let alone died from it. One of the biggest mysteries is why so few children have gotten sick. A recent study of 745 children in China identified only 10 children with the virus. Seven of those children developed a fever, one of the virus' most common symptoms, and a few experienced coughing, a sore throat, and nasal congestion. None of the children had clear signs of pneumonia in their chest X-rays — a prominent sign of the virus in adults. Taken together, these symptoms indicate that the children's cases were mild.www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-case-children-infants-low-disease-expert-explain-why-2020-2?r=US&IR=TAs for seasonal flu. . ..some children die from flu each year. Since 2004-2005, flu-related deaths in children reported to CDC during regular flu seasons have ranged from 37 to 187 deaths. Even though the reported number of deaths during the 2017-2018 flu season was 187, CDC’s mathematical models that account for the under-reporting of flu-related deaths in children estimate the actual number was closer to 600.www.cdc.gov/flu/highrisk/children.htmAs to: www.who.int/news-room/q-a-detail/q-a-similarities-and-differences-covid-19-and-influenza "You'll note that the best estimates of mortality rates show that Covid-19 could be up to 30-40 times higher than seasonal influenza." I disagree. What comes over is WHO don't yet know. It is far too early to make a prognosis. "While the true mortality of COVID-19 will take some time to fully understand, the data we have so far indicate..." If the Health Organisation are basing their facts on China and Italy, for example, (Italy has the second highest elderly population in the world and China has one person in every ten over 60 years-old or 128 million populace), then nothing is certain until the virus moves through the rest of the world. Perhaps, by June, WHO will have a better understanding. Right now they do not and should not be publishing any prognosis at this early stage.
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Post by liquidskin on Mar 18, 2020 17:39:10 GMT
Well you're almost definitely right to scoff Flash. S&F & I shouldn't know more than many people, let alone the best. But is the world ignoring a much more simple and aggressive game plan?
The key question is, how many people aged 65 or below and without any serious underlying health problems have died across Europe, Britain & America? It's hard to find out. I'm pretty sure NONE have in the UK out of 2600 infected - but I'm not sure on that cos it's so secretive.
The vast majority of the people in this country or the western world are strong, a minority are not. Seems to me we're using our weak (minority) to defend when we should be using our strong (majority) to attack. This all depends on the numbers though.
I'm not happy at being told I have to potentially lose so much over what will most likely for me be a p***y little cold. And it will for the most. Lock up 20 million (Weak) and hit it head on with 50 million (strong). It's all about the numbers, who can tell me? I can't seem to find out.
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Post by liquidskin on Mar 18, 2020 18:10:41 GMT
It's maybe understandable that all leaders would take a defensive approach at first, when the numbers aren't there to read. It was the unknown. The numbers are there now, to a certain extent - extent enough maybe. Are they missing something?
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Post by liquidskin on Mar 18, 2020 18:11:31 GMT
By the way FB, I couldn't give a flying f**k about the cricket season or any sport right now, personally.
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Post by flashblade on Mar 18, 2020 18:23:05 GMT
Well you're almost definitely right to scoff Flash. S&F & I shouldn't know more than many people, let alone the best. But is the world ignoring a much more simple and aggressive game plan? The key question is, how many people aged 65 or below and without any serious underlying health problems have died across Europe, Britain & America? It's hard to find out. I'm pretty sure NONE have in the UK out of 2600 infected - but I'm not sure on that cos it's so secretive. The vast majority of the people in this country or the western world are strong, a minority are not. Seems to me we're using our weak (minority) to defend when we should be using our strong (majority) to attack. This all depends on the numbers though. I'm not happy at being told I have to potentially lose so much over what will most likely for me be a p***y little cold. And it will for the most. Lock up 20 million (Weak) and hit it head on with 50 million (strong). It's all about the numbers, who can tell me? I can't seem to find out. I understand where you're coming from, LS. Using your numbers, I'm not sure how you can actually lock up isolate the 20 million; most/many of them probably live in households with members of your 'strong' category.
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Post by gmdf on Mar 18, 2020 18:25:30 GMT
The key question is, how many people aged 65 or below and without any serious underlying health problems have died across Europe, Britain & America? It's hard to find out. I'm pretty sure NONE have in the UK out of 2600 infected - but I'm not sure on that cos it's so secretive. I've certainly read of at least 2 under 65s dying in the UK. This article (dated yesterday) mentions 7% of deaths in France were under 65: www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-51927790[On edit] And I've just come across this information from the Director of the French Health Authority: "There are 9,134 people who have tested positive for the coronavirus in France, and there have been 264 deaths - an increase of 89 in the last 24 hours. Of those infected, 2,626 are in hospital; 931 of them in intensive care, half of whom are under 60 years old". See:
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Post by flashblade on Mar 18, 2020 18:27:27 GMT
Fb, young people, including children, have died.
Children? Please find me the evidence. It is hard enough to find any that have caught the coronavirus let alone died from it. One of the biggest mysteries is why so few children have gotten sick. A recent study of 745 children in China identified only 10 children with the virus. Seven of those children developed a fever, one of the virus' most common symptoms, and a few experienced coughing, a sore throat, and nasal congestion. None of the children had clear signs of pneumonia in their chest X-rays — a prominent sign of the virus in adults. Taken together, these symptoms indicate that the children's cases were mild.www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-case-children-infants-low-disease-expert-explain-why-2020-2?r=US&IR=TAs for seasonal flu. . ..some children die from flu each year. Since 2004-2005, flu-related deaths in children reported to CDC during regular flu seasons have ranged from 37 to 187 deaths. Even though the reported number of deaths during the 2017-2018 flu season was 187, CDC’s mathematical models that account for the under-reporting of flu-related deaths in children estimate the actual number was closer to 600.www.cdc.gov/flu/highrisk/children.htmAs to: www.who.int/news-room/q-a-detail/q-a-similarities-and-differences-covid-19-and-influenza "You'll note that the best estimates of mortality rates show that Covid-19 could be up to 30-40 times higher than seasonal influenza." I disagree. What comes over is WHO don't yet know. It is far too early to make a prognosis. "While the true mortality of COVID-19 will take some time to fully understand, the data we have so far indicate..." If the Health Organisation are basing their facts on China and Italy, for example, (Italy has the second highest elderly population in the world and China has one person in every ten over 60 years-old or 128 million populace), then nothing is certain until the virus moves through the rest of the world. Perhaps, by June, WHO will have a better understanding. Right now they do not and should not be publishing any prognosis at this early stage. WC - I don't think your view is objective so I think we shall have to agree to differ. You seem to be willing to risk sacrificing an unknown quantity of people, in order to avoid disrupting your lifestyle.
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A.S.
2nd XI player
Posts: 60
County club member: Kent
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Post by A.S. on Mar 18, 2020 19:32:35 GMT
Whatever the rights and wrongs of this argument, by any measure you know things are really bad when the Eurovision Song Contest is cancelled.
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Post by flashblade on Mar 18, 2020 19:55:13 GMT
Whatever the rights and wrongs of this argument, by any measure you know things are really bad when the Eurovision Song Contest is cancelled. Every cloud has a silver lining.
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Post by Wicked Cricket on Mar 18, 2020 21:15:26 GMT
As expected, after advice from the ECB Sussex recreational cricket is CLOSING... for now.
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Post by Wicked Cricket on Mar 18, 2020 21:31:18 GMT
Fb,
My life has been highly disrupted from cancelling a holiday with my partner, along with restaurant bookings, not going to the cinema or theatre, not seeing my step children or grandkids due to self isolating etc.. we have even postponed a family get-together on Mothers Day, all in the name of helping to slow down any possibility of contagion. I do this as a responsible citizen and while I may not agree with the present medical facts, I do it because my loved ones wish it.
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Bazpan
2nd XI player
Posts: 191
County club member: Kent
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Post by Bazpan on Mar 18, 2020 22:54:05 GMT
" ... WHO and world governments have made an odd decision. Place the world's economy in dire straits to save a small minority of the world population ie. the over 70 year-olds ... " They call him the Vanessa Hudgens of the unofficial Sussex cricket forum.
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Post by Wicked Cricket on Mar 18, 2020 23:07:22 GMT
Ah, the 'go woke, go broke' brigade. Dare to question and you are ridiculed and pilloried on social media. Re: Hudgens, insensitive, yes, true, absolutely. For example, far more people have died from seasonal flu this month than from the coronavirus. Present tally for 2020 up to March 18thSeasonal flu deaths: 103,797. Coronavirus: 8,940.
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