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Post by Deleted on Jan 14, 2015 20:25:11 GMT
Presumably Robinson is under orders from Downton and Moores to run the entire tour like it's a glorified net session - particularly for Jonathan Trott.
But ffs why?
Trott has no more of an England future than Pietersen. They are both 'damaged goods' and come with psychological baggage. Trott is 34 at the start of next season, the same age as KP. And the baton has already passed in the middle-order to the likes of Moeen, Root and Ballance.
So why is Trott grinding it out for 11 hours in this last innings? And why did he continue to bat on in the last match when a genuine future England prospect, Sam Billings, who had spent less time at the wicket, was forced to 'retire'?
What is the point of playing Plunkett and Rankin, about whom we know everything there is to be known, while the promise of Overton and Dunn is wasted on carrying the drinks?
I'm not blaming Robinson. As said, I'm sure he is acting under orders. But this Lions tour is shaping up to be a total waste of time and money from which England will learn nothing , apart from the fact that Trott is one of the most selfish flat-track bullies in the business and that when Anderson and Broad's dodgy joints finally give out, we will have to look elsewhere than Plunkett and Rankin for their replacements.
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Post by hhsussex on Jan 14, 2015 22:33:40 GMT
Glad you said that borderman. I was beginning to wonder if it was just me, when I kept seeing these Tweets and comments about how well Trott was doing on his way back, that wondered...way back to where? Surely we all accepted that Trott was someone whose fallibilities had been exposed and that this had hurt him. There is no shame in this, but there is no return from that situation, as Trescothick and Yardley in their different ways have shown. It is simply a case of taking a step sideways and finding an alternative way of getting satisfaction from the game.
Last season we saw that Ballance had the potential, at least, to replace Trott as a simple and direct No3, bringing different characteristics of strokeplay to the job, but impressing with his desire and appetite for the contest. What we seek from the A tour is someone else who has the hunger to succeed in adverse conditions - and for these purposes I would certainly include a flat, lifeless, boring track of the kind this match was played on.
The selection of most of the Yorkshire team is itself an admission of either weakness in our national resources or a lack of imagination in strategic thinking; if they were so very strong, why are there not more of them in the various teams representing England at primary level? The selection of Rankin is an admission of defeat, the most unhappy of Flower's beanpoles from last winter being uprooted and implanted in a foreign soil with the vague hope that somehow it can support a new generation of healthy vines.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2015 10:47:39 GMT
The Trott net session comes a cropper - a fourth ball duck, undone as ever by a bowler who gets it up above 140kph.
The idea that he could ever play for England again is surely inconceivable. As soon as he gets to the wicket, any opposition captain is going to bring on his quickest bowler and instruct him to ping Trott's helmet. And except on the flatest of flat wickets, Trott will come unstuck. The idea of throwing him back in this summer to get traumatised by Mitch Johnson again is both cruel and potentially dangerous.
Good to see Adam Riley is playing. If Robinson likes the look of him, there's another alternative to Tredwell there. Kent cannot keep both off-spinners happy and so one will inevitably leave at some point ..
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Post by hhsussex on Jan 19, 2015 14:10:02 GMT
After James Vince takes a wicket to end a 210 run stand, and Trott bowls a spell of 4-2-9-0, another non-bowler finally gets a wicket to end a partnership and show the bowling strength of our A team...  |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 19, 2015 14:55:20 GMT
Teunis de Bruyn is a great prospect. The first 'test' v the Lions was only his tenth f/c match. Since then he's taken 369 runs off the England bowling for once out!
Adam Riley seems to have gone into a serious decline - 12 wicket-less overs for 80 runs this afternoon. It's a shame because he started so well in his first full season last year, and then from mid-season onwards got steadily less effective and lost his ability to take wickets.
Over-promoted too soon or batsmen working him out, or a bit of both? Robinson's assessment of what has gone wrong for him would be very interesting to hear.
Think it means no Tredwell on loan to Sussex next season, as I'm pretty sure Riley will be relegated back to second string spinner at Kent behind the man who spun Sussex to victory v Warwicks at Horsham in 2014.
Young enough still to have a great future ahead of him, though. Has he impressed Robinson enough to take a punt on him on loan at Sussex instead of Tredwell in 2015? Probably not, because at the moment he appears to be less effective with the ball than Zaidi and with the bat is one of the most clueless number 11s in county cricket.
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Post by hhsussex on Jan 19, 2015 15:10:43 GMT
Teunis de Bruyn is a great prospect. The first 'test' v the Lions was only his tenth f/c match. Since then he's taken 369 runs off the England bowling for once out! Adam Riley seems to have gone into a serious decline - 12 wicket-less overs for 80 runs this afternoon. It's a shame because he started so well in his first full season last year, and then from mid-season onwards got steadily less effective and lost his ability to take wickets. Over-promoted too soon or batsmen working him out, or a bit of both? Robinson's assessment of what has gone wrong for him would be very interesting to hear. Think it means no Tredwell on loan to Sussex next season, as I'm pretty sure Riley will be relegated back to second string spinner at Kent behind the man who spun Sussex to victory v Warwicks at Horsham in 2014. Young enough still to have a great future ahead of him, though. Has he impressed Robinson enough to take a punt on him on loan at Sussex instead of Tredwell in 2015? Probably not, because at the moment he appears to be less effective with the ball than Zaidi and with the bat is one of the most clueless number 11s in county cricket. From the reaction to the last few games of last season, when Zaidi finally got some runs and picked up a few wickets on flatter tracks, I diodn't get the feeling that Sussex would be looking for any loan spinners in 2015. And the way Kent fought to ensure Tredwell wasn't left feeling isolated, as he undoubtedly was in June, suggests that they would be unlikely to agree to any further proposals. That leaves us hoping that Zaidi will show greater consistency, though his figures in Bangladesh over the winter don't suggest much hope on the bowling front: as batsman: | Matches | Innings | NO | Runs | HS | Average | 100 | 50 | Ct | | 12 | 12 | 2 | 475 | 141 | 47.50 | 1 | 1
| 3 |
and as bowler: | Balls | Maidens | Runs | Wickets | BB | Average | 5WI | 10wm | | 505 | 2 | 326 | 8 | 2-47 | 40.75 | 0
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Post by leedsgull on Jan 19, 2015 16:53:13 GMT
It seems to have been overlooked that Azeem Rafiq is "on trial" at Hove. I have always thought he would be an excellent signing.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 19, 2015 17:50:58 GMT
From the reaction to the last few games of last season, when Zaidi finally got some runs and picked up a few wickets on flatter tracks, I diodn't get the feeling that Sussex would be looking for any loan spinners in 2015. And the way Kent fought to ensure Tredwell wasn't left feeling isolated, as he undoubtedly was in June, suggests that they would be unlikely to agree to any further proposals. That leaves us hoping that Zaidi will show greater consistency, though his figures in Bangladesh over the winter don't suggest much hope on the bowling front: as batsman: | Matches | Innings | NO | Runs | HS | Average | 100 | 50 | Ct | | 12 | 12 | 2 | 475 | 141 | 47.50 | 1 | 1
| 3 |
and as bowler: | Balls | Maidens | Runs | Wickets | BB | Average | 5WI | 10wm | | 505 | 2 | 326 | 8 | 2-47 | 40.75 | 0
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If it pans out as I expect and Tredwell is reinstated as Kent's first-choice spinner, I suspect Riley would be available on loan. He's not going to learn anything playing for Kent seconds/Bexley in the Kent PL. And Kent's financial crisis has just taken a catastrophic turn for the worse with a £1.1 million debt repayable in full in seven weeks time, so they will be desperately pinching any penny they can from the wage bill. My point is that there is no way we would want Riley. Last time I saw him he had lost his loop and wasn't getting the ball above the eye-line. In other words, yet another promising spinner ruined by too much T20/one day bowling. I'd rather go with Zaidi , who despite his bowling stats in Bangladesh was starting to look quite canny at the back end of last season once he'd worked out what county cricket was about. I still think Robinson's claim that he's a top six batsman was a ludicrous over-expectation, but he is a decent number seven or an outstanding number eight and had new boots and car to prove it. No room for Riley in a first-choice XI that I suspect will go: Wells Nash Joyce Cachopa Wright Prior/Brown Zaidi Jordan Shahzad Magoffin Mills |
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Post by hhsussex on Jan 20, 2015 11:08:22 GMT
Robson's second innings duck brings his current run of form (starting from the Lords Test against India) to 16 first class innings for 309 runs, with a single 50 for Lancashire against Middlesex. It's a dreadful trot (no pun intended) and it has been extensive and played on all kinds of pitches against various types of bowling. It will surely end, but it begs the question that if he is so much a "touch" player as to thrive on form alone, and his technique is not strong enough when luck is out, should we be continuing to regard him as a prospective opener? Surely this is the mark of the good county cricketer, who has brilliant patches but goes no further?
If not Robson, then perhaps Lyth, who has made runs well in this match, and sustained his form throughout last season. He looked the classiest player on the field at Arundel last summer, though inferior players made higher scores on that stupefyingly boring pitch, and has made runs everywhere: over 900 in the same number of innings as poor Robson.
On edit: first goatmouth of the year to me as Lyth goes with only 5 runs added since I wrote the above. Nevertheless I think he's the long-term stayer!
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Post by grandavefan on Jan 21, 2015 9:44:36 GMT
Am I to assume that all this talk about Riley, Rafiq and Zaidi means we've lost Beer to another county on loan?
Why would Sussex sign him and the go sign another spinner?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2015 9:53:11 GMT
Am I to assume that all this talk about Riley, Rafiq and Zaidi means we've lost Beer to another county on loan? Why would Sussex sign him and the go sign another spinner? Because Beer doesn't play four day cricket and is seen by Robinson as a white ball only bowler? He's played just six LVCC games since he made his debut way back in 2008. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2015 11:52:15 GMT
So what was learnt on this Lions tour? Not a lot, according to my old mate Ivo Tennant who covered the tour, other than that Trott has apparently leapfrogged Robson for consideration as Cook's opening partner for the West Indies tests in April. Heaven help us - although if it comes to pass, I suspect it will be Trott who needs help when the Windies quicks start whistling the ball around his head.
The extent to which Robinson was 'in charge' as team manager is also open to question. I think we knew Flower was going out there with the team, but according to IT England batting coach Graham Thorpe and England selector Mick Newell were also there. As Flower, Thorpe and Newell all have permanent and recognised positions in the England set-up and Robinson is brought in to assist on these Lions tours pro tempore, he was arguably fourth in seniority on the tour, which cannot have been easy.
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Post by hhsussex on Jan 23, 2015 16:11:16 GMT
And, just because the whole Tour couldn't possibly get more farcical and less like the development process for a new generation of players, Tim Bresnan to join England Lions for last three one-day matchesYes, it's Bressie-lad, back to reinforce the miserably un-represented Yorkshire contingent in three one-dayers and seemingly getting the endorsement of selector James Whitaker that he is the standby for the World Cup squad in case of injury. No wonder Robinson goes off on trips to lion enclosures; there's little enough for him to do with the top-heavy management structure referred to in earlier posts, and the knowledge that those of his younger charges who aren't already crocked are subordinate to Flower's lucky talisman. |
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Post by hhsussex on Feb 2, 2015 11:19:32 GMT
Amidst all the run-inflation and the propaganda campaign to reinstate Trott that bedevilled the earlier part of the A tour, the one-day matches have been interesting so far for the development of Roy as a promising opener, for the rediscovery of Stokes in both disciplines, and for the possibilities in both batting and keeping of Billings. The latter was unlucky to be filched out of a chance of showing what he could do in the ridiculous first two matches where umpteen batted and bowled, but he is now promising rather more than Bairstow has shown over the last two years. I'd like to see him in a first-class match to compare with Buttler, but it would be nice to think of England in a year or two with a genuine all-rounder with the ball at 6 in Stokes, and ditto with gloves at 7 in Billings. All we would need then is for Stokes to come to Sussex and parallels with the 70s would be complete!
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