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Post by flashblade on Nov 6, 2021 10:53:18 GMT
So, re the Yorkshire affair - how would a right wing report differ from a left wing report? They might put different slants on the story, but it doesn't alter what actually went on. How does politics affect the principle? We disagree on the principle, that's the point. What the left see as racism the right see as banter. Where was he when it happened? What was he saying back? Why not pull someone to one side? Why say now? If someone calls you a name, tell them not to. Don't harp on about it ten years later cos your career has failed. Why do lefty broadsheets think it's more important to challenge name calling from a white person than black on black murder or mass child rape committed by non whites on whites? Each by the thousand year on year. Yet some moron calls Rashford or this lad a name and they go through the roof. Totally disproportionate agenda. I find that all a bit muddled. Your opening paragraph displays no understanding of what it must be like to be racially abused. BTW, the racism was reported to YCCC years ago - not 10 years after the event. Why do you like to divide people into left and right - these are lazy labels that make everyone sound extreme enemies? There is a massive spectrum in between the extremes. Do you not agree that racism is a problem? You're damning the 'right' by suggesting that they regard racism as banter.
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Post by tiptoes on Nov 6, 2021 11:16:19 GMT
Baron Patel of Bradford appointed Chair of YCCC with a view to leading the club out of a dire racial crisis. Has a passion for cricket, was raised in Bradford and senior experience in administration and social services. So far so good.
But as his name implies, he's a man of Indian descent, and while the racism at Yorkshire speaks of Asian victimisation from what I've read it's been specifically anti Pakistani and anti Muslim, with the 2 main protagonists both being of Pakistani heritage and Muslim. It's no secret that Pakistan and India are deeply hostile to each other since their country was annexed in 1947 causing the creation of Pakistan with 3 wars having been fought between them over the land of Kashmir since the break up. India is predominantly of Hindu religion while Pakistan is Islamic further exacerbating the differences. When the 2 nations play each other in World Cup matches in the UK the police are put on red alert knowing the fierce rivalry and tensions could break out into violence between the fans although that threat has not been realised.
The point is that while this appointment may seem to be a sop to end racism and advance the cause of Asian cricket in the county, Pakistani Muslims in the area might see it as typical ignorance to their plight and not a start to addressing their concerns nor the underlying reasons of their discontent.
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Post by joe on Nov 6, 2021 11:25:49 GMT
So, re the Yorkshire affair - how would a right wing report differ from a left wing report? They might put different slants on the story, but it doesn't alter what actually went on. How does politics affect the principle? We disagree on the principle, that's the point. What the left see as racism the right see as banter. Where was he when it happened? What was he saying back? Why not pull someone to one side? Why say now? If someone calls you a name, tell them not to. Don't harp on about it ten years later cos your career has failed. Why do lefty broadsheets think it's more important to challenge name calling from a white person than black on black murder or mass child rape committed by non whites on whites? Each by the thousand year on year. Yet some moron calls Rashford or this lad a name and they go through the roof. Totally disproportionate agenda. This could only be said from a white privileged perspective and why racism is endemic across the world. We can not even start to understand how his life has been affected by the racial abuse he’s been subjected to. The only thing we can do is accept that it happened and be part of the solution going forward.
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Post by tiptoes on Nov 6, 2021 12:06:08 GMT
Re above, it's a fair point.
All this navel gazing from the pc bores on here. Gary Ballance,the first accused, has said that Rafiq was his best mate on the cricket circuit which I take at face value. The personal comments he made to his teammate while coarse and unpleasant were made in the spirit of matey humour although tactless and ill conceived. No doubt Ballance was unaware that behind his bumbling jokiness he was causing understandable hurt to Rafiq who on the outside went along with it despite his inner turmoil.
That's not to excuse Ballance's lack of knowledge in boundaries as to what is acceptable banter and what isn't but the fact that the comments were made by a mate in jest, even though a lot was entirely inappropriate, is different when made by someone who likes you than by someone who doesn't, and as Ballance himself said, should be seen in that context.
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Post by flashblade on Nov 6, 2021 12:26:34 GMT
Re above, it's a fair point. All this navel gazing from the pc bores on here. Gary Ballance,the first accused, has said that Rafiq was his best mate on the cricket circuit which I take at face value. The personal comments he made to his teammate while coarse and unpleasant were made in the spirit of matey humour although tactless and ill conceived. No doubt Ballance was unaware that behind his bumbling jokiness he was causing understandable hurt to Rafiq who on the outside went along with it despite his inner turmoil. That's not to excuse Ballance's lack of knowledge in boundaries as to what is acceptable banter and what isn't but the fact that the comments were made by a mate in jest, even though a lot was entirely inappropriate, is different when made by someone who likes you than by someone who doesn't, and as Ballance himself said, should be seen in that context. "All this navel gazing from the pc bores on here" What on earth does that mean? What's a PC bore? Your push back against the racist claims focuses solely on Ballance's statement, and you choose to believe his blokey version of events. Wait until the DCMS hearing before trying to denigrate the views of your "PC bores"
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2021 13:57:42 GMT
We disagree on the principle, that's the point. What the left see as racism the right see as banter. Where was he when it happened? What was he saying back? Why not pull someone to one side? Why say now? If someone calls you a name, tell them not to. Don't harp on about it ten years later cos your career has failed. Why do lefty broadsheets think it's more important to challenge name calling from a white person than black on black murder or mass child rape committed by non whites on whites? Each by the thousand year on year. Yet some moron calls Rashford or this lad a name and they go through the roof. Totally disproportionate agenda. This could only be said from a white privileged perspective and why racism is endemic across the world. We can not even start to understand how his life has been affected by the racial abuse he’s been subjected to. The only thing we can do is accept that it happened and be part of the solution going forward. Marvellous post Joe. This is exactly my sentiments. I now actively choose to ignore liquidskin in here because the hate he chooses to spread makes me feel a little sad for him. Must be horrible having that darkness in your soul
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2021 14:22:39 GMT
The insinuation that Rafiq is just doing this for the money is particularly dense given that he doesn't stand to receive any sort of compensation from this but he could already have a six figure sum in the bank had he taken Yorkshire's hush money.
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Post by gmdf on Nov 7, 2021 10:34:02 GMT
Whilst I am sure some here will wish to continue debating whether being called a 'Rosbif' (something I have never been called in around 50 holidays to France, by the way, so uncommon is it) is just as bad as the use of 'p*ki' to someone of Asian descent (hint: it isn't), those who actually want to remain in the 21st Century rather than wallowing in 1970s style 'humour', might find this article balanced and sensible: Trigger warning: it's from the Guardian! Yorkshire CCC racism storm should focus on institutions, not people
Racist behaviour does not occur in a vacuum, and the ultimate lesson here is how many of our structures are indicted
www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2021/nov/06/yorkshire-ccc-racism-storm-azeem-rafiq-cricket
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Post by flashblade on Nov 7, 2021 10:42:31 GMT
Whilst I am sure some here will wish to continue debating whether being called a 'Rosbif' (something I have never been called in around 50 holidays to France, by the way, so uncommon is it) is just as bad as the use of 'p*ki' to someone of Asian descent (hint: it isn't), those who actually want to remain in the 21st Century rather than wallowing in 1970s style 'humour', might find this article balanced and sensible: Trigger warning: it's from the Guardian! Yorkshire CCC racism storm should focus on institutions, not people
Racist behaviour does not occur in a vacuum, and the ultimate lesson here is how many of our structures are indicted
www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2021/nov/06/yorkshire-ccc-racism-storm-azeem-rafiq-cricketI think it's an excellent article. However, FWIW, I posted it yesterday at 8:23. unofficialsussexccc.freeforums.net/thread/1717/racism-issue-yorkshire-ccc?page=4
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Post by gmdf on Nov 7, 2021 11:02:34 GMT
Whilst I am sure some here will wish to continue debating whether being called a 'Rosbif' (something I have never been called in around 50 holidays to France, by the way, so uncommon is it) is just as bad as the use of 'p*ki' to someone of Asian descent (hint: it isn't), those who actually want to remain in the 21st Century rather than wallowing in 1970s style 'humour', might find this article balanced and sensible: Trigger warning: it's from the Guardian! Yorkshire CCC racism storm should focus on institutions, not people
Racist behaviour does not occur in a vacuum, and the ultimate lesson here is how many of our structures are indicted
www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2021/nov/06/yorkshire-ccc-racism-storm-azeem-rafiq-cricketI think it's an excellent article. However, FWIW, I posted it yesterday at 8:23. unofficialsussexccc.freeforums.net/thread/1717/racism-issue-yorkshire-ccc?page=4Ah, didn't see that post! Apologies.
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Post by longstop on Nov 8, 2021 11:21:14 GMT
As stated in my earlier post, I'm keeping this thread for discussions directly related to the Yorkshire CCC racism issue. If you have other comments on this topic which are NOT related to Yorkshire CCC, you will find there is a thread at this link in the Off Topic area - unofficialsussexccc.freeforums.net/thread/1719/general-racism-issues-spawning-yorkshire. I had to make a slightly arbitrary split to separate the thread, so apologies if some of the flow has been broken. I'm sure you will all manage!
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Post by flashblade on Nov 8, 2021 16:55:11 GMT
Azeem Rafiq: Yorkshire's new chair Lord Patel says ex-player should be praised as 'whistleblower' A very positive statement - let's hope he clears out all the rotten apples. www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/59206664
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Post by tiptoes on Nov 8, 2021 18:56:51 GMT
Why is Adil Rashid so silent?
If he's been a victim or witnessed racism he's certainly keeping his powder dry. Any notional spin doctors wanting to give even more ballast to the narrative would be telling him to speak out publicly if he's got a story to tell.
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Post by liquidskin on Nov 8, 2021 22:35:28 GMT
The insinuation that Rafiq is just doing this for the money is particularly dense given that he doesn't stand to receive any sort of compensation from this but he could already have a six figure sum in the bank had he taken Yorkshire's hush money. You forgot to edit what you wrote. It needs it.
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Post by joe on Nov 9, 2021 6:02:05 GMT
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