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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2015 10:21:54 GMT
One cricinfo reporter after seeing England beat India in the Tri-Series three weeks ago wrote that he had detected a "new spirit" around Morgan's "new England".
"They're living their dreams. These are their wonder years," he gushed of our new heroes.
As he had only arrived in Australia the day before, we'll put it down to jet lag and over-indulgence on the flight out...
On edit: and here's what the same reporter thinks of the "new England" three weeks later:
"uncompetitive ...in danger of undermining the credibility of this competition... devaluing the value of TV rights and short-changing ticket-holders with their failure to compete ... embarrassing...looked as if they do not belong... humiliating... let us not pretend this result was an aberration... they simply aren't very good...dreadful ... debacle...arrogant... shattered ... lost kittens ...a sick pigmy."
This is tabloid trash journalism at its worst in which consistency is irrelevant and it doesn't matter what you say as long as you say it stridently enough to grab attention. England are living their dreams or they are the worst side ever to wear the cap. It's the wonder years or they are lost kittens. From new spirit to a sick pigmy in three weeks. Nothing boringly in between is allowed.
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Post by Wicked Cricket on Feb 20, 2015 11:13:10 GMT
Big concerns off the field.
Another defeat and the media will be all over Peter Moores like a wake of vultures. Someone has to take the blame and the
Coach and Captain normally get it, whilst the ECB get away scot-free for their years of backward-thinking.
The idea that you change the county cricket 40 over format to 50 overs as a way of improving things is nonsense. The
main reason why 50 overs has developed amongst other nations is because of the T20 Franchise tournaments, where both
batsmen and bowlers use the new techniques learnt and then bring them over into 50 over cricket. Bowlers, for example, have
learnt how to bowl at the death. The England bowlers have not. There is a growing and embarrassing gulf which has quickly
become apparent in this World Cup.
Agreed, England have faced two of the tournament favourites in their first two matches but this has been a vitally important
wake-up call. No-one is surprised by the two defeats but what has surprised many is how big the gulf now is between England
and the other top sides. Unless you are forward-thinking in cricket, you end up as a runt of the litter.
Which poses the question, if Moores is sacked where does Robinson fit into the picture? Will he return to the frame just as a new
season begins and Sussex suffer a similar fate to Lancashire? Another contender is Paul Collingwood who has suddenly popped up
in the media recently. A skip and a hop over from Scotland won't be a problem.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2015 11:20:15 GMT
if Moores is sacked where does Robinson fit into the picture? Will he return to the frame just as a new season begins and Sussex suffer a similar fate to Lancashire? England play Ireland in an ODI on May 8 in Dublin, only three days after the final test v West Indies finishes in Barbados (don't ask which idiot thought that was a smart piece of scheduling). The word is that nobody - players or coaching staff - involved in the Windies tour will be going to Dublin and that Robinson will take charge of the side for that game as a one-off. After that... who knows? West Indies are so poor you'd think we would win the series out there and Moores woukld save his bacon for the Ashes series. But were we to lose in the Caribbean... |
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Post by hhsussex on Feb 20, 2015 11:43:13 GMT
if Moores is sacked where does Robinson fit into the picture? Will he return to the frame just as a new season begins and Sussex suffer a similar fate to Lancashire? England play Ireland in an ODI on May 8 in Dublin, only three days after the final test v West Indies finishes in Barbados. The word is that nobody - players or coaching staff - involved in the Windies tour will be going to Dublin and that Robinson will take charge of the side for that game as a one-off. After that...? The word, according to this forum's favourite journalist ( www.espncricinfo.com/icc-cricket-world-cup-2015/content/story/833959.html ) is also that Taylor is favourite for captaincy in that game and "Don't be surprised if Andy Flower also returns to the coaching team in some role. " Mind you, that was before last night's debacle, when the new heroes turned into these sick pygmies or kittens, or whatever metamorphosis is in vogue in the bars of Wellington these days. Whether there was any truth in what he wrote then it must be subject to another of those agonising lurches of opinion reminiscent of the Party line in the Thirties whenever some unfortunate event occurred that needed to be taken account of, like a purge or the betrayal of an ally. For what its worth, I agree with fluffy that Moores is about 2 crucial games away from receiving Downton's publicy expressed "unequivocal support". Those games could be against Scotland and one of the other minnows, or worse still, if we ignominiously scramble into 4th place and then go out to a minnow from the other group in the knock-out stages. If that particular push comes to shove I can see a caretaker appointment for the West Indies, rather on the model of the old England touring sides: a Tour Manager with limited responsibility for that particular exercise, and that might be Robinson or Collingwood, but would be unlikely to cut any ice with the serious business of planning for the future. That might take a bit of time, a lot of cash,and some serious negotiation to persuade someone with skill and credibility, a Ford perhaps, that not only will the pay be good and the facilities forthcoming, but that there is a serious prospect of the English game being structured to provide the right conditions for developing a side and maintaining its competitive edge when not engaged in international competition. The qualities required for a job at that level seem to me beyond Robinson, whose great strengths and weaknesses we can all see at Sussex. He doesn't have any real understanding of the values of spin bowling, except as an occasional, necessary evil, and for all his great loyalty to players whose hidden strengths he can appreciates, a loyalty that is strongly reciprocated by most of the team, finds it hard to work with the talented individualist who questions his precepts. Finally, he is at the peak of his abilities doing what he does; it is inconceivable, as it would be depressing, to have to listen to him explaining away another Mitchell Johnson onslaught for which his charges were "not quite ready", or explaining why he hadn't selected a second spinner to play Pakistan in the Gulf. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2015 12:11:03 GMT
If Taylor is favourite to captain England in the ODI v Ireland on May 8, that presupposes that he won't be in the Test party to the West Indies, as allegedly - and logistically, given the dates - the side v Ireland will consist of players who weren't in the Caribbean.
As there are no England Lions games in 2015, I guess the ODI in Dublin was scheduled as a surrogate Lions fixture, which is rather arrogant of the ECB, especially as Ireland may emerge from the World Cup with more respect and honour than England.
But Robinson v Joyce will be an attractive prospect for Sussex supporters, at least...
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Post by hhsussex on Feb 20, 2015 12:29:30 GMT
If Taylor is favourite to captain England in the ODI v Ireland on May 8, that presupposes that he won't be in the Test party to the West Indies, as allegedly - and logistically, given the dates - the side v Ireland will consist of players who weren't in the Caribbean. As there are no England Lions games in 2015, I guess the ODI in Dublin was scheduled as a surrogate Lions fixture, which is rather arrogant of the ECB, especially as Ireland may emerge from the World Cup with more respect and honour than England. But Robinson v Joyce will be an attractive prospect for Sussex supporters, at least... Now there's a rare conjunction of words.  |
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jim
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Post by jim on Feb 20, 2015 14:08:55 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2015 19:43:25 GMT
It has just been pointed out to me that the England capain hung around substantially longer than the New Zealand captain, facing a highly creditable 41 balls.
Surely we should derive considerable national pride from that? It's just one of the many positives Morgs and the boys can take from the game (although I can't think what the others are right now. Ask me later).
McCullum's ephemeral, blink-and-you-miss-it innings only lasted 25 balls before he was completely and hopelessly undone by a cunning, cleverly disguised waist high full toss. He's never going to get himself into any kind of form if he can't occupy the crease better than that...
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Post by mrsdoyle on Feb 20, 2015 20:16:21 GMT
Do you think Ireland would like Morgan back?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2015 20:40:56 GMT
Do you think Ireland would like Morgan back? Do you think England could swap him for Joyce?  |
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Post by hhsussex on Feb 21, 2015 7:37:04 GMT
And today's interesting little poser is:
If West Indies can up their game and recover from embarrassing defeat to emphatic victory over a more-fancied side, can England do so too?
Discuss.
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Post by joe on Feb 21, 2015 10:20:52 GMT
Now that Bangladesh have a point from the abandoned game v Australia it puts England in an even more precarious position of progressing past the first round.
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Post by coverpoint on Feb 21, 2015 10:25:14 GMT
I want the Scots to win just so that Cork has to run over Tower Bridge naked.
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Post by hhsussex on Feb 21, 2015 12:27:02 GMT
I want the Scots to win just so that Cork has to run over Tower Bridge naked. Would that be with the roadway open for shipping to pass through, or closed? |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 21, 2015 18:31:21 GMT
I saw today that Moores has started talking about England having a team of "emerging players". I can see what he means because the likes of Moeen,Ballance,Buttler, Taylor, Woakes and Finn are a long way from being proven internationals.
But I hadn't heard him use the phrase before and my concern was that it sounded a little like an excuse , the fairly explicit sub-text being 'all the other major countries have established sides and England is at a disadvantage because we don't, so you have to make allowances for us as emerging players will always be inconsistent'.
The problem is that Bell, Morgan, Broad and Anderson are not 'emerging players' - and they've been atrocious.
The knives are out for Moores, with Vaughan in the Telegraph this morning at the head of the pack of assasins. But he made a fair point: a coach in his second spell in charge cannot expect a prolonged honeymoon and has to deliver more or less instantly. He also dared to mention the elephant in the room , asserting that it was utter folly that Pietersen isn't playing...
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