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Post by jonboy on Jan 8, 2017 14:01:02 GMT
Pretty much all of our second eleven would be home grown
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2017 14:38:02 GMT
Welcome back to Sussex, David Wiese. Titans CEO Jacques Faul has this morning confirmed that Wiese has signed a contract with Sussex as a kolpak.
"He came to us and played his cards on the table and we supported and respected his decision because he gave it a lot of thought," according to Faul.
I'd be pretty certain Davis's pre-season thinking is : five specialist batsmen (Nash, Wells, Van Zyl, Evans and Wright) followed by Brown at six, Wiese at seven, Robinson/Archer at eight, Philander (replaced by Jordan after the IPL) at nine and two from Magoffin/Garton/Briggs at ten and eleven.
There's runs all the way down that order with Finch and Machan as reserve batsmen in the event of injuries.
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Post by lovelyboy on Jan 8, 2017 15:00:47 GMT
Welcome back to Sussex, David Wiese. Titans CEO Jacques Faul has this morning confirmed that Wiese has signed a contract with Sussex as a kolpak. "He came to us and played his cards on the table and we supported and respected his decision because he gave it a lot of thought," according to Faul. I'd be pretty certain Davis's pre-season thinking is : five specialist batsmen (Nash, Wells, Van Zyl, Evans and Wright) followed by Brown at six, Wiese at seven, Robinson/Archer at eight, Philander (replaced by Jordan after the IPL) at nine and two from Magoffin/Garton/Briggs at ten and eleven. There's runs all the way down that order with Finch and Machan as reserve batsmen in the event of injuries. Looks a very good side that to me. Although I would say as it stands there is more chance of Wiese playing ipl than CJ Actually it will be interesting to see whether we let Wiese play Cpl like he did last year as well |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2017 15:17:35 GMT
I would say as it stands there is more chance of Wiese playing ipl than CJ Yes, team mates at RCB last year but neither retained for the 2017 edition. I think Jordan has already indicated that he intends to put himself in the draft for 2017 and I'd be confident his exploits in the Big Bash will get him a berth - I think he's the second leasding wicket-taker in the the current tournament. |
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Post by lovelyboy on Jan 8, 2017 15:33:40 GMT
I would say as it stands there is more chance of Wiese playing ipl than CJ Yes, team mates at RCB last year but neither retained for the 2017 edition. I think Jordan has already indicated that he intends to put himself in the draft for 2017 and I'd be confident his exploits in the Big Bash will get him a berth - I think he's the second leasding wicket-taker in the the current tournament. Interesting I didn't realise Wiese hadn't been retained either |
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Post by hhsussex on Jan 8, 2017 18:57:06 GMT
Welcome back to Sussex, David Wiese. Titans CEO Jacques Faul has this morning confirmed that Wiese has signed a contract with Sussex as a kolpak. "He came to us and played his cards on the table and we supported and respected his decision because he gave it a lot of thought," according to Faul. I'd be pretty certain Davis's pre-season thinking is : five specialist batsmen (Nash, Wells, Van Zyl, Evans and Wright) followed by Brown at six, Wiese at seven, Robinson/Archer at eight, Philander (replaced by Jordan after the IPL) at nine and two from Magoffin/Garton/Briggs at ten and eleven. There's runs all the way down that order with Finch and Machan as reserve batsmen in the event of injuries. Corroboration here www.timeslive.co.za/sport/cricket/2017/01/08/Kolpak-takes-another-Protea-David-Wiese-signs-contract-with-Sussexbut nothing yet from Sussex. It isn't often recently that their Marketing team has failed to retain a firm grasp on their release of news stories, so I wonder whether the shared byline for Firdose Moonda indicates that it was a South African leak that was then picked up by ESPN Cricinfo and exploited before Sussex had the chance to present it in their own terms? It will be interesting to see what Davis has to say about the role of Wiese in the squad and the effects on the prospects for the new generation of Sussex seamers. I can see what you're getting at borderman, but it doesn't really hold water. 5 batsmen, 3 of whom are to some extent on trial - Wells in a return to opening, van Zyl to show he can cut it in different conditions from South Africa, Evans to hold down a sustained spot throughout a season - is fairly thin, certainly on the evidence of the sheer disaster that overwhelmed Sussex last September when injury and absence cruelly exposed the lack of suitability of Christian Davis and the sheer inexperience of the reserves. Brown at 6 is one spot too high for comfort as we saw, particularly when the responsibility impacts on his wicket-keeping and on the close catching around him. Good luck to Wiese and I hope he makes a big impact in the white ball games, sufficient to justify his fee and if he is to bat 7 in the championship then he really needs to work on his game. I'm sure he's a nice guy and he is a talented cricketer, but I don't think those are the particular talents that Sussex needs this year. Needless to say I would be delighted to be proved wrong.  |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2017 19:43:27 GMT
but nothing yet from Sussex. It isn't often recently that their Marketing team has failed to retain a firm grasp on their release of news stories, so I wonder whether the shared byline for Firdose Moonda indicates that it was a South African leak that was then picked up by ESPN Cricinfo Exactly that. Although not a leak but an on-the-record statement by the Titans CEO which was reported on this forum several hours before Moonda picked up on and reported it on cricinfo. (on edit: I've just looked at cricinfo and can't actually see that she has reported it on there?) Disagree about Brown not being fit to bat at six. He scored 2,011 f/c runs for Sussex over the last two seasons at an avge of 48 which, if he didn't have the additional burden of keeping wicket, would qualify him to bat considerably higher than six. Wiese is a quality all-rounder with 31 scores of over 50 in 82 f/c matches, including nine centuries (one of them a double) and a career average of 36. Not sure that suggests "he really needs to work on his game" before he can be regarded as a number seven bat. Sussex are now blessed with one genuine all-rounder and three bowling all-rounders in Robinson, Jordan and Archer. There are runs aplenty in this team all the way down to nine or ten , so no need for more than five specialist batsmen. And how many counties play six pure batsmen? In the magnificent championship decider at Lords in Sept, Middx had Simpson at six (f/c avge 31) and Yorks had Hodd at six (f/c avge 28). And Somerset, the other title contenders in that thrilling final round had Lewis Gregory (f/c average 21) at number six. Ben Brown's record far outstrips his peers batting at number six in the three top counties in the first divison last season and I think you are being very, very harsh in your judgement of his (in)ability to bat in that position! |
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Post by hhsussex on Jan 8, 2017 20:52:07 GMT
but nothing yet from Sussex. It isn't often recently that their Marketing team has failed to retain a firm grasp on their release of news stories, so I wonder whether the shared byline for Firdose Moonda indicates that it was a South African leak that was then picked up by ESPN Cricinfo Exactly that. Although not a leak but an on-the-record statement by the Titans CEO which was (reported on this forum several hours before Moonda picked up on and reported it on cricinfo. (on edit: I've just looked at cricinfo and can't actually see that she has reported it on there?) Disagree about Brown not being fit to bat at six. He scored 2,011 f/c runs for Sussex over the last two seasons at an avge of 48 which, if he didn't have the additional burden of keeping wicket, would qualify him to bat considerably higher than six. Wiese is a quality all-rounder with 31 scores of over 50 in 82 f/c matches, including nine centuries (one of them a double) and a career average of 36. Not sure that suggests "he really needs to work on his game" before he can be regarded as a number seven bat. Sussex are now blessed with one genuine all-rounder and three bowling all-rounders in Robinson, Jordan and Archer. There are runs aplenty in this team all the way down to nine or ten , so no need for more than five specialist batsmen. And how many counties play six pure batsmen? In the magnificent championship decider at Lords in Sept, Middx had Simpson at six (f/c avge 31) and Yorks had Hodd at six (f/c avge 28). And Somerset, the other title contenders in that thrilling final round had Lewis Gregory (f/c average 21) at number six. Ben Brown's record far outstrips his peers batting at number six in the three top counties in the first divison last season and I think you are being very, very harsh in your judgement of his (in)ability to bat in that position! It is not so much about Ben Brown not being fit to bat at No 6 as the frailty and thin cover of the 5 above him putting enormous pressure on him to exceed expectations constantly. It is ridiculous for Sussex to have 11 pace bowlers, some of whom can bat, but only 8 batsmen. Here is the run-down: Nash - fit, in form, suited to his position Wells - found more settled form last season after being played between 3 and 5 Finch - fine prospect but not yet established in a regular place Van Zyl - good record in South Africa until picked for Tests, not so good subsequently. May have problems adapting to softer wickets. Evans - mixed record, not a regular in Championship teams Wright - when fit, excellent Machan - great prospect, inconsistent and injured last year, and Davis said of him that his wrist problem had not responded to the operat ion Salt - Enthusiastic but inexperienced and no breakthrough innings yet plus Brown and I'm sorry if you think I'm hard on him but his wicket-keeping last year was very poor and I've no doubt that the combination of captaincy responsibility and constant requirement to shore up collapses affected his game. Given the strong likelihood that 2 or 3 of the above will either be unfit or find it a struggle I'd be happier if he were at 7 and Sussex had one strong dedicated batsman in the squad. As to Wiese, his English figures are 9 innings for 153 runs, with one 70 not out and one score of 47. That certainly suggests he needs to work on his game in English conditions, whatever triumphs he has achieved in South Africa. Last year Robinbson scored 389 in 14 innings, Jordan 323 in 7 and Archer 195 in 8. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2017 23:29:15 GMT
plus Brown and I'm sorry if you think I'm hard on him but his wicket-keeping last year was very poor and I've no doubt that the combination of captaincy responsibility and constant requirement to shore up collapses affected his game. Given the strong likelihood that 2 or 3 of the above will either be unfit or find it a struggle I'd be happier if he were at 7 and Sussex had one strong dedicated batsman in the squad. The main impact on Brown's batting from the "constant requirement to shore up collapses" has surely been to bring out the very best in him? The guy scored four f/c centuries in 2015 against first div attacks and and another four red ball hundreds in 2016 - which means his record with the bat over 2015 and 2016 is markedly better than anyone else in the Sussex top six, his eight red ball centuries easily outstripping Wells (5), Joyce (4) , Machan (3) , Wright (2) and Finch (2). I agree captaincy early last season was something Brown had not anticpated and wasn't ready for. But you also say he was a "very poor" keeper. I'm surprised but defer to your judgement because you saw him far more than I did : I only did five or six days at Hove all season (although I confess I did see him concede a lot of byes against Jofra Archer, running down the slope from the Cromwell end and bouncing the ball miles over his head for four!) But I don't get how batting him at seven rather than six is going to improve his keeping? In the modern game, no successful county can afford a keeper who doesn't bat in the top six : it wrecks the balance of almost any side. Brown is clearly good enough to bat in the top order. If the corollary of that is, as you suggest, that he's no longer up to the job behind the timbers, Sussex will have to sign a better keeper and bat Brown as a specialist batsman at four or five. |
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Post by Wicked Cricket on Jan 9, 2017 13:17:16 GMT
Now we have 3 South Africans playing for Sussex alongside the Head Coach, perhaps the county should be renamed Safsex CCC? |
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Post by hhsussex on Jan 9, 2017 13:38:52 GMT
Finally the Sussex press release goes out and Davis says: “He will add significantly to our white ball team with his bowling and powerful batting at the death and has already shown his potential last season in the longer format. His experience will be invaluable to our young developing team.” Given the massive flexibility within the squad, at least for pace bowling options, it will be interesting to see the differences between the sides that play Championship cricket and the sides that play T20 and 50 overs. There could be room for both borderman and me to be right about the best choice of allrounder.  As for the batting and the wicketkeeping in whiteball...we'll just have to wait and see. Here is the updated list of contracted players, including the Overseas. On Edit: The Sussex news release confirms that he will arrive at Hove in June. This presumably means that he expects to play in the IPL - although not drafted - and has specifically negotiated with Sussex for this freedom. That adds significance to Davis's comments about his whiteball prowess since he will not contribute to most of the first half of the season's championship commitments. Question: how many of the new contracts that Sussex has committed to recently have included this provision? |
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Post by fraudster on Jan 15, 2017 16:21:50 GMT
We're an embarrassment. A cheating shameless embarrassment - to me anyway. What happened to the countless statements by Davis about using home-grown talent more? Utter rubbish. Get rid of the Kolpak mercenaries and get rid of Davis too.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2017 17:04:03 GMT
We're an embarrassment. A cheating shameless embarrassment . That was 2011 when Lou Vincent, Naved Arif and - allegedly a.n.other still un-named - fixed a match. In the context of Sussex being unique among the 18 county clubs in the modern era for being convicted of match-fixing, could you tell us who you are now accusing of "cheating"? |
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Post by hhsussex on Jan 15, 2017 19:57:11 GMT
We're an embarrassment. A cheating shameless embarrassment - to me anyway. What happened to the countless statements by Davis about using home-grown talent more? Utter rubbish. Get rid of the Kolpak mercenaries and get rid of Davis too. The first cuckoo of spring? Or just some bees buzzing in a bonnet? |
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Post by deepfineleg on Jan 16, 2017 10:57:47 GMT
I wonder when the change of policy from homegrown to Kolpak occurred. unofficialsussexccc.freeforums.net/thread/729/members-forum-hove-31-august"MD joined the meeting and before taking questions offered his own thoughts on the season: the white ball cricket played had been unacceptable. Young players were the key to the future but one had to accept that young people make mistakes and not criticise them for it. There was clearly a need for rebuilding but it would not be met by loan signings. He could go to South Africa tomorrow and sign up half a dozen Kolpaks but it wouldn’t ensure the future of the team. There was a need to work on careful team development in order to build a side that would not only win promotion but be sure to stay in Division 1." Perhaps there is a glut of low cost SA kolpaks trying to beat perceived Brexit deadlines? |
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As for the batting and the wicketkeeping in whiteball...we'll just have to wait and see.
