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Post by hhsussex on Aug 10, 2014 14:15:05 GMT
Nor did Jordan. Having watched both bowl at the Ageas Woakes was unlucky at the Ageas Bowl and could have taken a couple of wickets with a bit more luck. Jordan seems to have lost his wrist position which means his bowling is a bit like a sprinkler i.e. firing in all directions. This was why Jordan wasn't given the new ball. All the commentators agreed Woakes should be given the new ball. Take off those Sussex coloured spectacles HH. Pace is nothing without control. Jordan looks someway short of international class. He bowls too short and too many four balls. Stokes should come in for Jordan as he has a better batting and bowling average than Jordan. Actually I don't have Sussex coloured spectacles, or any other colour. I like Jordan because he is a genuine fast bowler, big and with spirit and enthusiasm. I agree he had lost his way, and I have also read Agnew and others about the wrist position. I'm not entirely convinced, as the position seemed to be fine at Horsham. I think it is more a question of attitude and confidence, and that has been a problem for Jordan before. However, I have no wish to make a big argument about it - just please do not, whatever else you do, characterise me as as a last-ditch Sussex supporter! |
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Post by coverpoint on Aug 10, 2014 14:20:32 GMT
The problem is that the Jordan who has bowled for England has been a shadow of the one that bowled for Sussex. Holding was scathing in his criticism of Jordan and it is clear none of the Sky pundits think he or Woakes are good enough to play for England and having watched large chunks of the last two tests I tend to agree with them. England only won the last two tests because Anderson, Broad and Moeen stepped up. England looked a better attack with Stokes and Plunkett in the team. From a Sussex perspective the worst thing that could happen is for Jordan to continue in the England team when there are major techincals flaws that need ironing out.
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henryr
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Post by henryr on Aug 10, 2014 19:04:24 GMT
It doesn't help the whole debate that none of the 3/4 seamers have done much with the bat (Stokes apart, for the wrong reasons), and in fact it's only Plunkett who surprised on that front. I fear England have got themselves in a situation they had with ODIs (mainly) many moons ago in that rather than trusting bowlers (eg Finn maybe) to do their job, we could end up with more bits and pieces players (as they currently are) such as Stokes, Jordan and Woakes (this generation's Derek Pringle I reckon), as we once did with Ronnie Irani, Craig White et al, and not being quite sure what to expect of them.
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Post by hhsussex on Aug 18, 2014 8:46:20 GMT
The consolidated averages (see attachment) for the India and Sri Lanka tests make interesting reading. In batting Root, Ballance and Buttler stand head and shoulders above some pretty ordinary performances aggregated over the 7 matches. Bell, Moeen Ali, Robson and Cook all showed their worth at some stage, but nowhere near consistently. Anderson stands out from the other bowlers both by virtue of average and strike-rate,47.68, sustained over 294 overs in 7 matches - a remarkable and sustained workload, whatever the quality of the opposition, and proving that the accusations during the last Australian tour that he had passed his peak were unfounded. Broad and Moeen present perfect contrasts of strike-rate and economy whilst taking wickets at about the same cost, and there is not much between the performances of Jordan and Plunkett in figures. The outstanding stats here for me are the catching and wicketkeeping figures. 5 players (Root, Ballance, Bell, Cook and Jordan) held at least an average of 1 catch in every match played, with Cook's 12 in 7 (1.71 per match) pre-eminent. This and the wicketkeeping figures - a total of 37 catches held between Prior and Buttler (5.14 per match) - tell the story of the 3 S's: seam, swing and swish. A combination of good bowling, lively wickets (for the most part) and some indolent batting produced the nicks, but the mark of a really good team is to hold them safely, and by the end of the summer England were doing that consistently, with Jordan adding to his credentials with some great catching and fine all-round fielding. Spare a thought here for Matt Prior; in what other context would a 5 Test record of 26 catches behind the stumps and a batting average of just under 30 be accounted such an abject failure? |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 30, 2014 20:44:43 GMT
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Post by flashblade on Aug 31, 2014 7:37:24 GMT
BM, I fear your obvious personal animosity towards George Dobell is detracting from your otherwise balanced and thoughtful comments on Cricinfo news articles. In the spirit of this message board, perhaps you should stick to criticising the article, not the writer!  |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2014 16:44:44 GMT
Dobell is deeply unpopular in the England dressing room, where they believe that he shows an indecent glee in the way he reports every English defeat and is out to rival Warne as Cook's most trenchant critic.
Mind you, Cook does make it easy. This is what he said aftet the latest defeat: "We didn't play the spin very well. We didn't in Cardiff either. But they bowled well, and did turn it." Perhaps that's why they call it spin, Einstein!!!
As for Dodgy Dobbers, contrast his attacks on Cook with his constant brown-nosing of Trott - who he dropped right in it, of course, with that horrible, hubristic, ill-considered interview at the start of the season (an interview, btw, that the ECB advised Trott not to give).
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2014 18:15:49 GMT
I think this quote from cricinfo's Andrew Hughes sums it up nicely: "Not so long ago, England's disaster stew was simmering away nicely and we were preparing to tuck into a hearty feast of failure and recrimination. Then they won the Test series and we all felt a bit empty." Fortunately, a couple of bad ODI defeats came along to fill our plates again! www.espncricinfo.com/blogs/content/story/775543.html |
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Post by mrsdoyle on Sept 1, 2014 18:39:05 GMT
I see the article states that Trott has been passed fit by England, that would be the same medical set up that completely failed to see he was ill in the first place then. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2014 20:11:32 GMT
The latest from Cricinfo's Mr Schadenfreude - anyone still backing Cook "resembles those who deny climate change". And the answer? Naturally enough, to bring back Trott, who has "a batting average 20 per cent higher" than anyone else. Sometimes you finish an article and wonder why you wasted your time, because you knew exactly what it was going to say before you read it! www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/story/777277.html |
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Post by mrsdoyle on Sept 2, 2014 21:59:03 GMT
I can't help but wonder whether India would have won the test series if they had applied themselves.
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Post by flashblade on Sept 3, 2014 6:47:31 GMT
I can't help but wonder whether India would have won the test series if they had applied themselves. Quite probably. Their batsmen just don't seem to possess the test match mindset - too much emphasis on limited overs cricket in India. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 3, 2014 8:04:30 GMT
Groundsmen and coaches! If they produced better cricket wickets we'd have better cricket, spin bowlers, batsmen who could play spin and NO DIBBLY DOBBLERS! The bane of slow, low, boring wickets and aimless games.
That won't make Cook a better player but it might produce a whole heap of talented players. Then we might compete.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 3, 2014 22:06:15 GMT
The latest from Cricinfo's Mr Schadenfreude - anyone still backing Cook "resembles those who deny climate change". And the answer? Naturally enough, to bring back Trott, who has "a batting average 20 per cent higher" than anyone else. Sometimes you finish an article and wonder why you wasted your time, because you knew exactly what it was going to say before you read it! www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/story/777277.htmlWell yes BM, but when I see you quoting Dobell I can also predict what you are going to say. You obviously have a personal problem with him and seem obsessed in your criticisms. For me, i treat him like any other journalist. I have little respect for most journalists. In my professional capacity, I was given some media training. I was given guidance on how to gain press attention, in particular that most journalists are lazy, so if you give them good material to fill their allocated space, they will keep coming back. For me, this proved very effective, and I gained good coverage on TV and the press. Dobell has to fill space most days on Cricinfo. He is not the main reporter, so he has to find a separate angle. Sometimes, I agree with him, sometimes not. But in this, I see no difference between him, and most other journalists, though I am also conscious that Kim, the poster on here I most admired before his sad death, was very supportive of Dobell. You tell us you were a journalist, though as you have also told us you have just celebrated your 60th birthday, I presume you have retired early. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2014 7:34:47 GMT
Well you guessed my age correctly - I didn't tell you but it was not difficult for you to find out as hhsussex "outed" me on my birthday by starting a many happy returns thread in which he divulged the figure! But who told you I was retired? I wish! It might even have been me who gave you your media training as over the years I have regularly lectured on such courses!!!
As for lacking respect for all journalists and most of them being lazy, you should be wary of tarring them all with the same brush. For every Dobell there is a CMJ and for every tabloid cheapskate scribbler digging dirt on Panesar or Pietersen there is a quality broadsheet writer like Vic Marks or Michael Atherton offering insightful analysis of the game.
And, of course, cricket has traditionally been blessed above all other sports by great writers in the press box, from Cardus and Arlott through Woodcock and Marler on to Engel and Scovell and down to the present day.
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